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Lukrau

Commentary: Immigration Topic KTyler(aff) vs AnthonySGHS(Neg)

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11 hours ago, Ktyler said:

Last I checked, the left can't even get the president impeached,

Oh no honey what is you doing

 

Also is your Aff literally Trump’s immigration plan I’m laughing so hard

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9 minutes ago, Lukrau said:

Oh no honey what is you doing

 

Also is your Aff literally Trump’s immigration plan I’m laughing so hard

Uh excuse you.

Don’t aid the neg. I know what i’m doing, back down please

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12 hours ago, Ktyler said:

There are countless harms to voting in negation and zero for aff, besides hurting your feelings since you see the aff as white supremacists.

Uh...

a) accusations of racism are not "hurt feelings" and historically discounting them as such has been a tool to delegitimize them as irrational, non-objective, or childish. Don't do it.

b) genocide is not "hurt feelings" it's genocide you cretin.

36 minutes ago, Ktyler said:

I know what i’m doing, back down please

Unless you debate in a circuit stuck in like the 70s I doubt that. Consult a coach. The plan is hilariously anti, extra, and untopical. You also have serious formatting issues in the 1ac, with the plan's "planks" and unhighlighted cards as a start. Whatever your politics or arguments, you also need to tone down the right-wing rhetoric. It's grating, anti-intellectual, and will alienate the 90% of the debate community who are part of this century.

Edited by seanarchy
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8 minutes ago, seanarchy said:

Uh...

a) accusations of racism are not "hurt feelings" and historically discounting them as such has been a tool to delegitimize them as irrational, non-objective, or childish. Don't do it.

b) genocide is not "hurt feelings" it's genocide you cretin.

Unless you debate in a circuit stuck in like the 70s I doubt that. Consult a coach. The plan is hilariously anti, extra, and untopical. You also have serious formatting issues in the 1ac, with the plan's "planks" and unhighlighted cards as a start. Whatever your politics or arguments, you also need to tone down the right-wing rhetoric. It's grating, anti-intellectual, and will alienate the 90% of the debate community who are part of this century.

Dude leave him alone you seriously have no chill, i must ask you to sincerely piss off cause we are in middle of a debate, hold your comments after the 2AR

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8 minutes ago, AnthonySGHS said:

Dude leave him alone you seriously have no chill, i must ask you to sincerely piss off cause we are in middle of a debate, hold your comments after the 2AR

Look I'm all for maintaining the integrity of the round, but this is dumb. The use of rhetoric that has been used since at least the civil rights era to discredit anti-racist politics is a nonstarter. He's defending Trump's immigration platform which is commonly recognized among the center to be grounded in racist assumptions.

Edited by seanarchy
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1 hour ago, Lukrau said:

Oh no honey what is you doing

 

Also is your Aff literally Trump’s immigration plan I’m laughing so hard

Get out you joke, I do not go into your rounds to straight disrespect you so you shouldn't either so im going to ask you stay quiet, it helps.

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If you want to comment on this vDebate, please keep it to this thread.

Let's also be decent to each other. Please review the guidelines. They'll be more heavily enforced as time goes on.

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5 hours ago, seanarchy said:

Unless you debate in a circuit stuck in like the 70s I doubt that. Consult a coach. The plan is hilariously anti, extra, and untopical. You also have serious formatting issues in the 1ac, with the plan's "planks" and unhighlighted cards as a start. Whatever your politics or arguments, you also need to tone down the right-wing rhetoric. It's grating, anti-intellectual, and will alienate the 90% of the debate community who are part of this century.

Just would like to say that I don't do any of the NSDA stuff. I'm a UIL debater and I do debate like they did in the 70's. My coach is old school and he taught me that way. I have never lost as the Aff so I believe that what I'm doing works. There isn't a formatting issue with my 1AC, it's a different style. I have a "right-wing rhetoric" because I debate in Texas. It forces republican debaters to play liberal-- it works. As for topicality, I've got my responses to those for actual debates. I'm sorry if you don't like the way I do things, but I've received nothing but positive responses about how I debate and how I organize and cut cards. I'm frankly you didn't attack the fact that I don't spread either.

Thank you for contributing your 2-cents. I will absolutely be changing the way I debate just because someone thinks that it's too old-fashion and conservative! Thanks!

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Look you do you and all style wise, I'm just speaking from the perspective of someone who debated on the national circuit. This is also how TFA works. Substantively, I have no idea why being a republican makes it acceptable to use anti-anti-racist rhetoric. I can't compel you to make any arguments or change your opinions, but surely you realize that Trump is a joke.

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X

 

I took the context of this post down. People keep downvoting me because of it.

Edited by Ktyler
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Yeah ok there's no point in continuing this. Trump is an idiot who appeals to some of the most racist and otherwise privileged segments of the American population. If you're gonna down vote me for saying so you're a tool.

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6 hours ago, AnthonySGHS said:

Get out you joke, I do not go into your rounds to straight disrespect you so you shouldn't either so im going to ask you stay quiet, it helps.

VDebates are not like real rounds - ppl comment on the round all the time... and have done so in lots of threads.

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Just now, Lukrau said:

VDebates are not like real rounds - ppl comment on the round all the time... and have done so in lots of threads.

You aren't making things any better. Please stop.

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5 minutes ago, Ktyler said:

You aren't making things any better. Please stop.

Do I not have a right to make jokes?  This is an online forum for practice debates.  It isn’t the TOC.  Relax.

 

I’m also fairly convinced that this round was trolling.  See the cross-x reply when asked for pronouns that said basically lmao liberal pronouns don’t matter le facts don’t care about le feelings xdd.  That combined with the anti immigrant rhetoric of the 1AC talking about immigrants that are more valued than others and many more things I found to be incredibly offensive, combined with the very strange formatting of the 1AC meant that I was 99% sure at least the Aff participant was trolling.

Edited by Lukrau
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Everyone needs to relax. This is a debate forum, not the War Room.

Different areas of the country have different forms of debate. Not everything takes after the national circuit, and some local circuits actively resist a lot of the tendencies of the national circuit. There's reasonable discussions to be had about how debate should be, but demeaning difference helps no one.

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2 hours ago, Ktyler said:

Just would like to say that I don't do any of the NSDA stuff. I'm a UIL debater and I do debate like they did in the 70's. My coach is old school and he taught me that way. I have never lost as the Aff so I believe that what I'm doing works. There isn't a formatting issue with my 1AC, it's a different style. I have a "right-wing rhetoric" because I debate in Texas. It forces republican debaters to play liberal-- it works. As for topicality, I've got my responses to those for actual debates. I'm sorry if you don't like the way I do things, but I've received nothing but positive responses about how I debate and how I organize and cut cards. I'm frankly you didn't attack the fact that I don't spread either.

Thank you for contributing your 2-cents. I will absolutely be changing the way I debate just because someone thinks that it's too old-fashion and conservative! Thanks!

This aff is terrible. 

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lmao Zidao is probs right, but its probs best to wait for comments till after this debate. Then its probs best for everyone. 

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2 hours ago, seanarchy said:

Yeah ok there's no point in continuing this. Trump is an idiot who appeals to some of the most racist and otherwise privileged segments of the American population. If you're gonna down vote me for saying so you're a tool.

 

1 hour ago, Lukrau said:

VDebates are not like real rounds - ppl comment on the round all the time... and have done so in lots of threads.

 

1 hour ago, ZidaoWang said:

This aff is terrible. 

 

40 minutes ago, Isbrar said:

lmao Zidao is probs right, but its probs best to wait for comments till after this debate. Then its probs best for everyone. 

All of you I hope you take time to reflect how bad this looks in any other context, let this sink in because even if you didn't mean it you just attacked someone based on political opinion, this nation is split right now and this doesn't help. If yall considered themselves then ask yourself what liberal ideals are and what the most important one is: Acceptance. I joined Debate to feel safe in my skin this is the only God Dammed place I feel safe to be myself the only place I can say my actual dammed pronouns the only place I can say my political opinion without feeling scared, what you guys just did reverses alot of that. I don't feel safe here, I don't want to feel this way and I feel weak for it but you guys made me feel worse, please take this not as a message of retaliation but as a plea, no matter how someone politiclly stands that you don't shoot them down cause we just become as bad as the people we hate. I know most of you get pissed when you see those "feminist" memes or those "libtard" memes but you just stooped just as if not more and I do forgive you, but the one you should say sorry too isn't me its Kasen and if you do not understand why that isn't my issue anymore that is yours

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16 minutes ago, AnthonySGHS said:

 

 

 

 All of you I hope you take time to reflect how bad this looks in any other context, let this sink in because even if you didn't mean it you just attacked someone based on political opinion, this nation is split right now and this doesn't help. If yall considered themselves then ask yourself what liberal ideals are and what the most important one is: Acceptance. I joined Debate to feel safe in my skin this is the only God Dammed place I feel safe to be myself the only place I can say my actual dammed pronouns the only place I can say my political opinion without feeling scared, what you guys just did reverses alot of that. I don't feel safe here, I don't want to feel this way and I feel weak for it but you guys made me feel worse, please take this not as a message of retaliation but as a plea, no matter how someone politiclly stands that you don't shoot them down cause we just become as bad as the people we hate. I know most of you get pissed when you see those "feminist" memes or those "libtard" memes but you just stooped just as if not more and I do forgive you, but the one you should say sorry too isn't me its Kasen and if you do not understand why that isn't my issue anymore that is yours

I'm sorry that I made you feel that way. This is not an attack on your identity or a political view. I just think the aff is bad. 

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Just now, ZidaoWang said:

I'm sorry that I made you feel that way. This is not an attack on your identity or a political view. I just think the aff is bad. 

I accept your apology but someone else deserves it more, even if you werent trying to be rude try to keep it contructive like say "Oh the evidence you use was to ....." even " Hey the Aff can be misinterpreted cause of this section"

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I wrote a very lengthy post on reddit a few days ago about this that I'll quote here.

Quote

Liberalism contains the seeds of its own destruction much more literally. In the same way, the liberal commitment to compromise and free speech, which arose in the Enlightenment in response to the Church's despotism, leaves plenty of room for the rise of fascism. Trump was elected after all, through liberal complacency, bureaucratic mechanisms, and the endless proliferation of the media spectacle he created - all the very same things Democrats now turn to to try and stop him.

I'm not a liberal. Liberalism is more or less based on tolerance and private property. I'm a Marxist. Absolute tolerance is a shit value b/c it's not a value, it's a lack of values that lets anything fill in. Karl Popper wrote extensively about the decay of absolute tolerance into fascism - see here.img

I think this is extremely important to understand. The alternative is what Zizek describes as the beautiful soul - someone who believes that all opinions and differences can coexist. *Spoiler* they cannot. It also strikes me as absurd to describe what I said as hateful, when it is descriptively accurate - Trump is an idiot, and he appeals to racists, sexists, homophobes, etc. I have no problem with your pronouns, and I doubt almost anyone who espouses the beliefs I've described does. The point is to not tolerate homophobia, cisnormativity, or their translations into policy, NOT to declare that everything is a wash and that all ideas are created equal.

I apologize if something I said made you feel unsafe, but I don't see how attacking racist rhetoric could translate into that feeling.

Edited by seanarchy
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I’m apologizing for anything bad that was taken out of Context. When I agree with zidao it wasn’t any attack on anyone or any beliefs . What I mean is I disagree with the aff structure. Like the cards and the formatting. Not any political statement. I was gonna explain further but for the time the debate was still on and I wanted to wait for the rfd. I’m sorry to anyone who felt bad or felt attacked. 

Edited by Isbrar

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14 minutes ago, seanarchy said:

I apologize if something I said made you feel unsafe, but I don't see how attacking racist rhetoric could translate into that feeling.

You might have just not even apologized. "Unsafe" isn't the right word, it's the blatant disrespect you dished out. And you can't apologize with "I'm sorry but..."

Just please move on.

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