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Datboy

Online Debate Tournament Reminder

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Greetings, 

 

As many of you are aware (most eagerly), our debate tournament is less than a week away (May 15th). Currently, there are twenty debaters enrolled for the tournament and I have five judges that are signed up for the tournament. I am seeking a minimum of five more judges for the tournament. Please, spread the word and ask around or see if anyone can recruit judges for this tournament. In addition to this, I would like to panel quarters, semis, and finals, and that will require a minimum of twelve judges. Everything else for the tournament is on par, and I will release the pairings for Rounds 1 and 2 Monday morning at 6 a.m. Don't worry, the official time that the round will start will be 3 p.m., giving the 1AC time to get home from school and have a full 24 hours to post their affirmative. 

 

If there are any questions, please PM me or comment. Either works. 

 

 

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Side note: In an effort to maximize full participation and keep the tournament fun for all, there will be closed tab. Unlike a normal tournament, judges will not tell who they voted for. Judges can give as much feedback as they like, but I think it is best to keep records anonymous until out rounds. Do you all agree or disagree?

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Side note: In an effort to maximize full participation and keep the tournament fun for all, there will be closed tab. Unlike a normal tournament, judges will not tell who they voted for. Judges can give as much feedback as they like, but I think it is best to keep records anonymous until out rounds. Do you all agree or disagree?

Even though I am not participating (I would love to, but finals), I know I would prefer if judges disclosed their decision. I don't think there should be a stringent rule on this, but leave the decision to disclose to the judges themselves. I know I pay a lot more attention to feedback after I've found out I've won or lost, otherwise I can't concentrate. I know some people feel the opposite, but at the end of the day, you do you :)

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Even though I am not participating (I would love to, but finals), I know I would prefer if judges disclosed their decision. I don't think there should be a stringent rule on this, but leave the decision to disclose to the judges themselves. I know I pay a lot more attention to feedback after I've found out I've won or lost, otherwise I can't concentrate. I know some people feel the opposite, but at the end of the day, you do you :)

I'm in favor of disclosing RFD's, trust me. However, I feel like a person going into round 6 knowing they are 1-4 would delay their speech doc or inevitably forfeit the round and that is no fun for all parties involved. If everyone going into round 6 thinks they have a good chance of clearing to outrounds, then it would decrease possible forfeiture. 

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I think that judges should submit their decision and RFD and that the debaters should be given their records as well as ballots after round 6, then elimination rounds should have public decisions/RFDs.

 

I also think that on panel decisions the ballots should be sent to you, Beck, and given all at once just to make sure one judge doesn't influence another's decision with their ballot.

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Yeah, I agree with you Snowball and Nick. I didn't make it clear, but I planned on releasing ballots after R6. I just didn't want to release them before R6 for the aforementioned reasons. In elims judges can disclose their RFD to the debaters because it won't impact the tournament at all. 

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I've been in communication with Exodus in regards to the tournament, and a question that they've posed is whether I will use MPJ or not to assign judges to rounds. If you are in favor of mpj, and are registered for the tournament please comment with a yes. If you are not in favor of it please comment with a no. If an overwhelming majority are in favor of mpj, I will ask all judges to quickly submit their paradigms before Friday and for debaters to give a list of judge prefs before Sunday. 

 

Thanks

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I'd say no on MPJ-

1. Not that many judges.

2. Most of them will have similar paradigms.

3. Leads to favoritism among the judge and debater pool, and we have competitors judging later rounds.

4. You probably won't get every paradigm and every pref sheet.

5. I think it should be random, and I like that people should have to adapt.

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I also vote against MPJ. In my experience, it tends to foster ideological inbreeding, and I would prefer to encourage debater flexibility.

Edited by CynicClinic

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I, again, am going to second Snowball, for all of the reasons listed. However, I think paradigms should be posted somewhere accessible before R1 starts.

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Agreed with both Snowball and NickDB8. Judge Adaptation is one of the most important skills to have as a debater.

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Oh, as a disclaimer, I'll be using a random generator for prelim pairings (R1-R2) just to avoid conflict of interests or any disputes (even though I really don't know anyone personally on this site). So, the luck of your first two rounds solely depends on the generator and no one else. 

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So judges are allowed to give feedback after each round but submit the ballot and RFD to you, Beck? Just clarifying to make sure that I'm not misreading anything.

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So judges are allowed to give feedback after each round but submit the ballot and RFD to you, Beck? Just clarifying to make sure that I'm not misreading anything.

Yep, you can give as much feedback as you like to each debater but please don't disclose who you voted for. Just send your ballot, along with your decision, to me. After Round 6 I will let everyone have their ballots and know their records. 

 

Also, there have been two entries drop from the tournament which now means that there are 18 entries. Since this is y'alls tournament I will propose a possibility: I can either keep outrounds at quarters (eight teams break) OR I can clear all teams to octos and give the top two seeds a bye and let everyone fight it out to finals. It is up to those debating and judging. Octos (where everyone clears) or quarters (where only eight teams clear). 

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Yep, you can give as much feedback as you like to each debater but please don't disclose who you voted for. Just send your ballot, along with your decision, to me. After Round 6 I will let everyone have their ballots and know their records. 

 

Also, there have been two entries drop from the tournament which now means that there are 18 entries. Since this is y'alls tournament I will propose a possibility: I can either keep outrounds at quarters (eight teams break) OR I can clear all teams to octos and give the top two seeds a bye and let everyone fight it out to finals. It is up to those debating and judging. Octos (where everyone clears) or quarters (where only eight teams clear). 

Breaking to quarters sounds good to at least have some glory in it as well as because people are gonna get tired after 7 vdebates. But wait until the day before in case anyone else drops.

 

Are we good on judges?

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Yep, you can give as much feedback as you like to each debater but please don't disclose who you voted for. Just send your ballot, along with your decision, to me. After Round 6 I will let everyone have their ballots and know their records. 

 

Also, there have been two entries drop from the tournament which now means that there are 18 entries. Since this is y'alls tournament I will propose a possibility: I can either keep outrounds at quarters (eight teams break) OR I can clear all teams to octos and give the top two seeds a bye and let everyone fight it out to finals. It is up to those debating and judging. Octos (where everyone clears) or quarters (where only eight teams clear).

 

I worry that if everyone cleared to octos, there would be little incentive for people to have meaningful prelim rounds. Not that the community is lazy, but 6 Vdebates back to back is a lot no matter how you slice it. If we remove the question of clearing, I have a feeling we'll see a lot more prelims being decided on forfeitures because someone's busy or missing deadlines for speech docs.

 

I would almost suggest, given the drawn-out nature of Vdebates and the small size of our field, either clearing to semis or reducing the number of prelims, because I really hope to see everyone on board the whole time.

 

Those are my thoughts

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I worry that if everyone cleared to octos, there would be little incentive for people to have meaningful prelim rounds. Not that the community is lazy, but 6 Vdebates back to back is a lot no matter how you slice it. If we remove the question of clearing, I have a feeling we'll see a lot more prelims being decided on forfeitures because someone's busy or missing deadlines for speech docs.

 

I would almost suggest, given the drawn-out nature of Vdebates and the small size of our field, either clearing to semis or reducing the number of prelims, because I really hope to see everyone on board the whole time.

 

Those are my thoughts

I have thought about this. Six rounds is a lot and it would require a lot of dedication on behalf of the debaters participating. I could limit the tournament to four rounds and clear to quarters if that would make it less stressful. 

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I have thought about this. Six rounds is a lot and it would require a lot of dedication on behalf of the debaters participating. I could limit the tournament to four rounds and clear to quarters if that would make it less stressful. 

Alternatively, we can have six prelim rounds, clear to semis, and just panel semis with five judges per room then have a possible seven judge panel final round?

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I have thought about this. Six rounds is a lot and it would require a lot of dedication on behalf of the debaters participating. I could limit the tournament to four rounds and clear to quarters if that would make it less stressful. 

 

I think it would. Even four prelims will still take a really long time. There are 8 speeches in a debate, and if we're allowing 24 hours per speech, we're looking at at least one week per prelim round. (Sure many people will be fast, but there will probably always be someone maxing out the time limits, and that affects when we can move on to the next round) And that's not even counting CX. 

 

I think four prelim rounds and breaking to quarters is the best way to go. We have 18 entries; 8 breaks is probably an appropriate number. That likely means all the 4-0 and 3-1 teams break, with maybe the highest seeded 2-2 teams breaking as well. Alternatively, if we have 6 rounds and break to semis, there could potentially be 5-1 screws which would be really frustrating. I would err on the side of fewer prelims and more generous breaks, because both of those things keep it exciting and give debaters more of a reason to be invested in the tournament.

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I think it would. Even four prelims will still take a really long time. There are 8 speeches in a debate, and if we're allowing 24 hours per speech, we're looking at at least one week per prelim round. (Sure many people will be fast, but there will probably always be someone maxing out the time limits, and that affects when we can move on to the next round) And that's not even counting CX. 

 

I think four prelim rounds and breaking to quarters is the best way to go. We have 18 entries; 8 breaks is probably an appropriate number. That likely means all the 4-0 and 3-1 teams break, with maybe the highest seeded 2-2 teams breaking as well. Alternatively, if we have 6 rounds and break to semis, there could potentially be 5-1 screws which would be really frustrating. I would err on the side of fewer prelims and more generous breaks, because both of those things keep it exciting and give debaters more of a reason to be invested in the tournament.

Couldn't have said it better! Four prelims and quarters break it is. Thank you all for the input.

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Unfortunately, I have another drop from the tournament which puts us at 17 debaters now. This means one debater will have a bye per round. Also, this really shrinks the field down.

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