Jump to content
ploupe

Colorado Policy Debate Institute

Recommended Posts

you can be a part of the movement to save CX/policy debate. The revival has begun...and I am willing to lead the charge. It starts with The Colorado Policy Debate Institute. It will be hosted at the conflict center in the Denver Metro Area June 24-26 (Beginning and Intermediate Session) and July 8-10 (Advanced Session). Whether you want to increase your skills, get started, or become nationally competitive, I can provide the training. Please e-mail for more details: paulloupe@gmail.com

 

I am looking forward to meeting those interested. I am looking for volunteers with experience or anyone willing to aid in the recovery of the greatest academic competition in the world. Together this can be the beginning of a new era of Colorado Policy Debate.

 

Have a good day,

 

Paul Loupe

Education Director & Founder,

A Partnership for Growth: Center for Counseling and Education

Director of Forensics,

Littleton High School

Edited by psych
  • Downvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Paul,

 

I'd be interested in working with students through this program. I tentatively plan on being in Denver on both of those dates, though my schedule is subject to change. I'll email you my info/credentials in the near future.

 

Greg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Word on the street is that some pretty good former Colorado debaters are working this camp.

I heard Greg Sobetski, who debated for Littleton is coming. He qualed to state three times with multiple appearances in out rounds including a finals appearance his senior year. He also broke at Berkeley and qualified to nationals. He currently coaches for George Washington.

Andy Lee is also working this camp, he is a two time jeffco district champion. former successful college debater for k-state and is the current coach at his alma mater Standley Lake High School. Where he has coached a couple of teams to success in their respective divisions.

Aaron Bernhardt, a former George Washington debater, has qualed to state numerous times and to nationals. While in high school he took third at state.

Will Van Treuran former Denver east debater will also be in attendance. Will is a 2 time state champion, National qualifier. In his Junior year he place very well at nationals. He finished off his senior year in high school with numerous out rounds at bid tournaments and in Colorado. He is currently a very successful debater for CU.

Don't miss this chance to work with great former Colorado debaters.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the goals of this institute are laudable, but if you're thinking of attending this instead of the Wyoming Forensics Institute, consider the following:

 

The price for the CPDI (before June 1st) is $349.

 

The price for the WFI two week is $725 and the three week is $1025 (including all lab fees, etc).

 

Hours of instruction at CPDI: 16

 

Hours of instruction/practice at WFI two week: 108.5 (without taking advantage of optional lectures).

 

Hours of instruction/practice at WFI three week: 169.5 (also without optional lectures).

 

By my math, you're paying $22.43 per hour at the CPDI.

 

At the WFI, you pay $6.68 per hour for the two week and $6.04 for the three week. That is an incredibly better deal.

 

In addition, consider that our costs go toward TWO MEALS A DAY AND A ROOM FOR YOUR ENTIRE STAY. You are basically paying peanuts to stay in a room and eat for two or three weeks and receiving some of the best debate instruction in the country for FREE.

 

People have spent years in jail for stealing less.

  • Downvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think Christopher's economic breakdown speaks for itself.

 

The diversity of the instruction at WFI simply cannot be beat. You have a staff that pulls almost entirely from the mountain region and have been enormously successful at any type of debate you can imagine.

 

Want to win your state tournament? We have people that have done that two or three times each.

 

Want to be a competitor at some TOC tournaments? We have people who have qualified to the TOC themselves and coached teams to winning records at that tournament.

 

Want to qualify and succeed at NFL nationals? Learn from those who have qualified innumerable times as well as placed at the tournament.

 

Want to learn how to be more effective on your local district at tournaments that have a mix of college judges to CHSAA judges who are sticklers for stock issues? Our staff members have debated in that environment and won some of the largest regular season tournaments in Colorado multiple times.

 

Want to learn how to be a better speaker and combine argumentative skill with more effective communication skills and persuasiveness? Staff has also won countless speaker awards at both the high school and even the highest echelons of collegiate debate.

 

Want to push the edge and learn about non-traditional or critical approaches to debate? We have people who have been both enormously successful in reading those arguments as well as coaching their development. Even if you aren't interested in such arguments yourself or don't have an opportunity to run them, being informed about them is the key to being able to effectively address them when your opposition brings them up.

 

New to debate and still trying to figure out the ropes? There is simply no better way to advance yourself than an intensive two weeks. Not only can we place you with students who are in a similar position and staff that are very effective at teaching the basics, a two-week camp gives you so many more opportunities to practice, drill and get debates under your belt than you can ever get during the course of a weekend.

 

You also walk away with an evidence set that will help push you forward in your own research endeavors for the season as well give you access to a wide panoply of lectures on the following: the present topic, debating disads, effectively using your case, topicality, counterplans, theory arguments, paradigms and judge adaptation, giving better cross examinations, preparing and succeeding at NFL nationals, developing a research plan for the season, criticisms and non-traditional methods of policy debate, etc etc. The lecture series alone is enough to justify the camp because it puts you into conversation with some of the best debate minds in the region.

 

Nothing in this post should be construed as bagging on Paul's endeavor. No matter what, I want as many kids as possible learning how to debate, whether its at WFI or down in Denver. And if the cost of WFI is truly out of your reach, by all means, attend Paul's camp. Just realize that affording tuition is very easily possible, even in an economy where you can't depend on your parents help. My senior year in high school I worked a job and did fundraising because I had to finance camp myself, but it was very within reach at basically the same price as it is today. Sometimes you have to work hard to make an opportunity open to you, but if you are passionate about policy debate and making yourself better, it is some hard work that is well worth it.

  • Downvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nothing in this post should be construed as bagging on Paul's endeavor.

 

This seems somewhat disingenuous to me, after following several paragraphs that speak to how much more WFI has to offer.

 

Maybe Paul can chime in here, but I don't think he is trying to compete with WFI; he would be stupid to try to.

 

I can't imagine how anyone could get nearly as much out of CPDI as they could out of WFI, but maybe some beginners don't want to spend 2-3 weeks of their summer in Laramie. Maybe some returning debaters want to use the advanced session of CDI to network with some other CO debaters who might be going to other camps, and then attend the 2- or 3-week WFI.

 

I'm not sure what Chris means by "People have spent years in jail for stealing less," but if he's suggest that Loupe is stealing by charging the rates that he is, that seems really uncool.

 

I went to WFI twice and would recommend it to people. If anything, the fact that you guys seem to think that CPDI is competition is cause for concern.

Edited by youngin19902003
UW is in Laramie, not Cheyenne. My bad.
  • Downvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Maybe Paul can chime in here, but I don't think he is trying to compete with WFI; he would be stupid to try to.

 

I have no idea what his motives are, but one of his sessions is during WFI, and there could be a direct economic choice forced for many people otherwise.

 

WFI is economically and instructionally superior, in my opinion, and that's what I pointed out.

 

I can't imagine how anyone could get nearly as much out of CPDI as they could out of WFI, but maybe some beginners don't want to spend 2-3 weeks of their summer in Cheyenne. Maybe some returning debaters want to use the advanced session of CDI to network with some other CO debaters who might be going to other camps, and then attend the 2- or 3-week WFI.

 

The advanced session coincides with part of WFI and some people probably don't have enough money to do both if they wanted to go to the dates that were separate. Maybe I wasn't clear, but if WFI and CPDI are a forced choice for one, it would be silly to not attend WFI.

 

I'm not sure what Chris means by "People have spent years in jail for stealing less," but if he's suggest that Loupe is stealing by charging the rates that he is, that seems really uncool.

 

You obviously don't know me very well. WFI is a steal, it's such a good deal.

 

 

If anything, the fact that you guys seem to think that CPDI is competition is cause for concern.

 

In the areas where it IS competition, kids should try to go to WFI. I don't know why that could be cause for concern by anyone's reasonable definition. You may disagree, but "cause for concern?"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
This seems somewhat disingenuous to me, after following several paragraphs that speak to how much more WFI has to offer.

 

Maybe Paul can chime in here, but I don't think he is trying to compete with WFI; he would be stupid to try to.

 

I can't imagine how anyone could get nearly as much out of CPDI as they could out of WFI, but maybe some beginners don't want to spend 2-3 weeks of their summer in Cheyenne. Maybe some returning debaters want to use the advanced session of CDI to network with some other CO debaters who might be going to other camps, and then attend the 2- or 3-week WFI.

 

I'm not sure what Chris means by "People have spent years in jail for stealing less," but if he's suggest that Loupe is stealing by charging the rates that he is, that seems really uncool.

 

I went to WFI twice and would recommend it to people. If anything, the fact that you guys seem to think that CPDI is competition is cause for concern.

QFA to what Berger said.

 

Loupe doesn't plan on competing with WFI at all. What Loupe is trying to do is bring better debate to colorado by starting a small camp for coaches and beginning debaters that would not other wise be able to or want to go to camp.

 

In fact, Loupe is sending a kid or two up to WFI this summer. Littleton has and most likely will always support the WFI

Edited by Jareth
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I have no idea what his motives are, but one of his sessions is during WFI, and there could be a direct economic choice forced for many people otherwise.

 

In general, I think it would be nice to give him the benefit of the doubt and guess that he put one of the weekends during WFI for reasons other than trying to make people choose between them.

 

 

WFI is economically and instructionally superior, in my opinion, and that's what I pointed out.

 

The advanced session coincides with part of WFI and some people probably don't have enough money to do both if they wanted to go to the dates that were separate. Maybe I wasn't clear, but if WFI and CPDI are a forced choice for one, it would be silly to not attend WFI.

 

There is no doubt that WFI is a better per unit rate. There might be some people for whom the difference in overall price is significant, however, and that means that WFI's economic superiority is not foregone. I'm glad that TCram worked as hard as he did in high school to pay for camp, but maybe other people don't want to/can't.

 

But I agree with you: if you have the money, time, interest in becoming a better debater, and can't do both, go to WFI.

 

You obviously don't know me very well. WFI is a steal, it's such a good deal.

 

My bad. Sorry for my confusion.

 

In the areas where it IS competition, kids should try to go to WFI. I don't know why that could be cause for concern by anyone's reasonable definition. You may disagree, but "cause for concern?"

 

I don't disagree at all, kids should try to go to WFI if they're into debate and they can. I just think that everyone knows, and that to argue as if that wasn't obvious suggests some belief that there is a plausible argument in favor of CPDI over WFI, something I don't believe.

 

Also, the substance of TCram's post is directed towards the instructional superiority of WFI, which is unchallenged. The fact that he felt the need to defend WFI's instruction compared to CPDI's is what worried me, because it seems that WFI's superiority should be so obvious.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Debate is good.

 

If anyone wants to attend both WFI and the CPDI, they should contact me. We'll work out a deal. In fact, I'll write a longer post about this tomorrow. In the meantime, my email is stannard@uwyo.edu if anyone's interested in such a deal.

 

mjs

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Debate is good.

 

If anyone wants to attend both WFI and the CPDI, they should contact me. We'll work out a deal. In fact, I'll write a longer post about this tomorrow. In the meantime, my email is stannard@uwyo.edu if anyone's interested in such a deal.

 

mjs

 

Since I was critical before, I feel like to be fair I should explicitly acknowledge how awesome it is of Matt/WFI to offer this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was not prompted to post because I was worried about anything at all. I was not prompted to post because I have ill will towards Paul in anyway whatsoever. I was speaking to a segment of Colorado debaters who might be concerned about the cost of WFI versus Paul's endeavor or whether WFI addressed their needs. You do realize that people advertise things in the hope of enticing potential consumers to try their product? They still do that these days, yes? My post was addressed towards debaters that are on the fence as to whether WFI is valuable for them in either terms of cost or what they might get out of it. The evidence Crowe and I provided was advanced as a means of answering their questions, again not to bag on Loupe (who is obviously sweet).

 

I'm glad that TCram worked as hard as he did in high school to pay for camp, but maybe other people don't want to/can't.

 

Do not patronize me. My example was not meant to be some heart-warming bit of Horatio Alger to make you 'glad' and I have a better sense than most people of knowing what people can or cannot afford. Yes, you are right if a person obviously does not want to come to WFI they will not work to come to WFI. I am addressing those out there who still think 725 dollars is a lot of money to come up with by letting them know that it is very easily within their reach should they have a desire to improve their debate skills at a price that they will not come across anywhere else in the country.

 

I am incredibly confused as to why you are so defensive about any of this. Crowe and I are simply speaking to those who are still on the fence about whether WFI is right for them. Are we trying to persuade them that WFI is the best camp for their money? Absolutely. Should it shake out that you can't pull together a trip to WFI, than please attend what Loupe is offering.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
My post was addressed towards debaters that are on the fence as to whether WFI is valuable for them in either terms of cost or what they might get out of it.

 

Then why post here rather than in the WFI thread?

 

Do not patronize me. My example was not meant to be some heart-warming bit of Horatio Alger to make you 'glad' and I have a better sense than most people of knowing what people can or cannot afford. Yes, you are right if a person obviously does not want to come to WFI they will not work to come to WFI. I am addressing those out there who still think 725 dollars is a lot of money to come up with by letting them know that it is very easily within their reach should they have a desire to improve their debate skills at a price that they will not come across anywhere else in the country.

 

I genuinely did not mean that to be a patronizing statement, but I understand how it came across that way, and I apologize. I actually meant what I said in that I am glad you worked as hard as you did because I liked having you as a judge and I believe you make the debate community better, and I assumed (perhaps incorrectly) that had you not gone to camp those things wouldn't have happened.

 

I am incredibly confused as to why you are so defensive about any of this. Crowe and I are simply speaking to those who are still on the fence about whether WFI is right for them. Are we trying to persuade them that WFI is the best camp for their money? Absolutely. Should it shake out that you can't pull together a trip to WFI, than please attend what Loupe is offering.

 

Crowe's first post is directed to people who are "thinking of attending [CPDI] instead of WFI," and is an attempt to make them reconsider.

 

I'm defensive about this because I felt like you guys were coming in and being unfair to Paul, and to the people considering his institute. I felt like you were piling it on unnecessarily, when everyone already knew that WFI was instructionally superior, and cheaper on a per unit rate.

 

And if you think that people didn't know these things, fine, I get why you're advertising them. You're trying to convince people that they should go to your camp instead of Loupe's. But how can you also say, "Nothing in this post should be construed as bagging on Paul's endeavor."? Everything in the post was directed towards saying that your camp is better than his.

 

But I don't want to keep arguing about this. I think we agree about the substance, and the rest of this consists of whether or not I'm an asshole, which might be a losing battle for me.

  • Upvote 1
  • Downvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I do want to chime in on this.

The purpose of CPDI is to strengthen Colorado Policy Debate. I have no wish to hurt WFI, only to bolster the ranks of a valuable activity that is waning in participation in Colorado. Partially (or mainly) due to University of Wyoming Forensics Wyoming has maintained a high level of Policy Debate participation. Colorado students need options and too often there is a false dichotomy (only two options, WFI or nothing). If students can't afford in money or time the WFI option those students should have options. I have taught at WFI and I will always support it for my own stduents as well as any high school stduent who can afford that option.

 

Please note my other post that offers a significant discount to students who wish to use CPDI as a starter camp for WFI or for any other camp students wish to attend.

 

Much like the spread of the Urban Debate League, I think each city and state needs there own core of debate competition.

 

Thank you for this discussion Alex and Travis. This stuff needed to be fleshed out. I know that you are both motivated by your combined love for this activity and all those who chime in on this discussion are a part of the solution to rebuild this activity and extend its value into the future.

 

Have a good day,

Paul Loupe

Littleton High School Debate Coach

CPDI Founder

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The advanced seimnar for CPDI will be held July 8,9, and 10. We have a great staff and we are building on a very successful novice seminar. Please contact me me if you wish to attend, no matter your experience or financial status, all students are welcome.

 

Peace,

Paul Loupe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Since I still lurk but am rarely out West these days, I didn't hear how this went. I am curious and hoping it was successful. Did anyone on here go? Who all taught? How many students? Other thoughts on the experience?

 

Thanks!

Kelly

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Faculty included Paul Loupe, Will Van Treuren, Aaron Bernhardt, and yours truly, as well as a special appearance by Omar Guevara. We had small groups of students, mostly from Denver School of the Arts, MLK High, and Littleton. As you know, the CX programs at DSA and MLK are in their infancies, so it was good to get some fresh blood into the CX community.

 

I think everyone who attended learned a great deal about debate and about what to expect from next year's topic. I think attendees benefited from an extremely high degree of personal attention.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

×
×
  • Create New...