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magicmasterk

Performance Aff T

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He is not even a coach.

 

http://www.baylordebate.com/

 

I don't believe this... Check the faculty in the Speech Communications Department.

 

Bill English retired as a coach in the 1970's or early 1980's.

 

Lighten up! What gives with you folks?

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I don't believe this...

 

Right. He retired as a coach in the 1970's or early 1980's. What gives with you folks?

 

Sorry I didnt get the joke that was quite a few years before I was born.

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This diatribe speaks for itself, and perhaps it says volumes about the debating skills the author purports to champion. I rest my position(s) on the judgment of anyone (and I hope they are few) who read(s) this exchange.

 

Suffice it to say, I'm glad this person doesn't teach at my daughter's school. Moreover, if this is what the study of philosophy does to people, I'm glad I'm not a philosopher.

 

I am sorry that this person is in pain, but I don't retract a single thing I've written or said. Other than that, I think the Japanese have a proper term for the remainder of my response to this outburst: mokustasu.

 

It would be a good idea for you to keep opinions like this one to yourself. If you can't engage the argument of a performative advocacy, that's fine. Maybe someone can teach you. But don't assume that your thirty year outdated framework of the round is somehow better than any other. Your comments were surprisingly offensive, and Scu was being particularly diplomatic. You responded with ad hom analysis. Interesting strategy. If you don't like debate, perhaps you would be better served either (a) creating your own event or (B) inventing a time machine.

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Scu was being particularly diplomatic. You responded with ad hom analysis. Interesting strategy. If you don't like debate, perhaps you would be better served either (a) creating your own event or (B) inventing a time machine.

 

Now - since you've invited me to get out of Dodge, I guess, ala Scu, I should say [expletive deleted] too. But I won't. I'll just say goodnight, and I'll see ya tomorrow.

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This diatribe speaks for itself, and perhaps it says volumes about the debating skills the author purports to champion. I rest my position(s) on the judgment of anyone (and I hope they are few) who read(s) this exchange.

 

Suffice it to say, I'm glad this person doesn't teach at my daughter's school. Moreover, if this is what the study of philosophy does to people, I'm glad I'm not a philosopher.

 

I am sorry that this person is in pain, but I don't retract a single thing I've written or said. Other than that, I think the Japanese have a proper term for the remainder of my response to this outburst: mokustasu.

 

While I think that the Scu's response was perhaps a little to extreme, I think it was justified. He obviously debates one way and you debate another. Your original posts could probably be summed up to "anyone who performs for debate can fuck off after the 1NC, because the 2ac is a surrender". Regardless of what you intended, that is how it came off. All the Scu did was respond in kind, he just moved straight to the point.

 

And, why is it necessary to attack Scu's debating skills? So what if he debates a different way, that doesn't make him a bad debater, nor does it invalidate his abilities in any way. I think you may be better served by creating a rationale as to why (arguably) the way he debates is bad or illegitimate, rather than ad-homs on his debating ability.

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This diatribe speaks for itself, and perhaps it says volumes about the debating skills the author purports to champion. I rest my position(s) on the judgment of anyone (and I hope they are few) who read(s) this exchange.

 

Suffice it to say I'm glad this person doesn't teach at my daughter's school. Moreover, if this is what the study of philosophy does to people, I'm glad I'm not a philosopher.

 

I am sorry that this person is in pain, but I don't retract a single thing I've written or said. Other than that, I think the Japanese have a proper term for the remainder of my response to this outburst: mokustasu.

 

There are a lot of things to say about this post. Dan and Bacon have gone over some of them. Your own apparant lack of debating ability, for example, if your response to a well-explained grievance is "well, you're a mokustasu" (I don't even know what that means, but it doesn't make you cooler to ad-hom in Japanese). Your hang-up on his use of the word fuck is also humorous. You're a grown man, you can fucking take a little exposure to language. Does the fact that he said fuck instead of [expletive deleted] invalidate the following two paragraphs?

 

And there's a bunch more about this post that hasn't been touched on yet, but what I really want to talk about is your attack on his debate ability, not because it was an ad-hom, but because of what it reveals. Why does he need to be a debate jesus and win the NDT twice to have valuable experience? Even if we accept the (way fucking wrong) premise of your post that Scu's use of 'fuck' reveals a deep and incurable flaw with his ability to debate, why does that matter?. He did years of work and gave back years of coaching, and fuck or no fuck doesn't change that.

 

This post wasn't even directed at me (obviously) and I'm not even a particular fan of performance, but even I found the notion that because he isn't up to your arbitrary standard of debating his experience doesn't count to be extremely offensive.

 

And don't try to be cute (you have an obnoxious penchant for failed attempts at it) by pointing out that I attacked your debating ability early on. It was pretty fucking clearly an ironic commentary based off the substance of your post, which is distinct from an attack used to invalidate experience.

 

I just wanted to flesh this out. I don't really feel like using more words on you.

 

[Edit] I know I said I was done, but I had to point out that he's not even "purporting" to "champion" debating "skill" - you invented all of that. He said he's been involved with the community on both sides for a long time. That's intrinsically valuable. Debaters debating and going on to be coaches. That relationship is the most important thing this activity has going for it, I promise you, and if you think that some debate skill pissing contest about the merit of performance is more important than this, then in terms of this community I feel comfortable declaring you worthless.

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Now - since you've invited me to get out of Dodge, I guess, ala Scu, I should say [expletive deleted] too. But I won't. I'll just say goodnight, and I'll see ya tomorrow.

 

... and you'll be engaging the argument then? Or will we just continue to all take note of your surprising inability to come to grips with the fact that the conventions of the game have changed in the past third of a century? Both, maybe. Either way, I guess. Whatever.

 

Fundamentally, I think your mistake is not realizing that everyone here is just as smart as you are, but possesses far more knowledge about what the game looks like than you do. In this thread, you've demonstrated that there are a number of common notions of debate theory and practice with which you are not familiar. That's to be expected. But don't pretend that it isn't the case. Tone it down a notch, be more open to new ideas, stop being such an ass, and find an argument. What are you so afraid of?

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The warrant is obvious. Any offense the aff has on Topicality being bad is non-responsive to all the reasons why Topicality is an apriori issue and how that helps education and fairness within the round. That's why Synergy's saying the only way to K T is to beat those standards and their terminal impacts..

thats what a kritik of T does anyways though....i dont see the distinction. And this is comming from an extremely critical debater who's well read in many different kritiks.

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... and you'll be engaging the argument then?

 

Yep. But not extensively, though.

 

Or will we just continue to all take note of your surprising inability to come to grips with the fact that the conventions of the game have changed in the past third of a century?

 

What you (and others) choose to do is up to you. Go nuts!

 

...your mistake...

 

Singular? I make more mistakes in a day than the Houston Dog Pound has fleas.

 

....everyone here is just as smart as you are...

 

I doubt that. I suspect that some are smarter, some are not, and some are about the same. In antediluvian days, we called that "individuality" and/or "diversity."

 

...stop being such an ass...

 

I know this term is no longer en vogue, but this raises real inherency pronlems. I gotta be me.

 

... find an argument...

 

What are we doing now? Engaging in foreplay?

 

What are you so afraid of?

 

Lots of things. My Top Ten:

 

10. Iraq and Iraqnids

9. Bush and his buddies

8. My ex

7. My ex's lawyers

6. My daughter's teenage friends

5. My daughter's teenage friends' lawyers

4. My teenage daughter

3. My teenage daughter's lawyers

2. My ex-law partners

1. My ex-law partners' lawyers

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...your response to a well-explained grievance is "well, you're a mokustasu" (I don't even know what that means, but it doesn't make you cooler to ad-hom in Japanese). Your hang-up on his use of the word fuck is also humorous. You're a grown man, you can fucking take a little exposure to language. Does the fact that he said fuck instead of [expletive deleted] invalidate the following two paragraphs?

 

1. I can take "exposure to language" without difficulty, but I'm a teacher, an Officer of the Court, and the father of a 16 year-old daughter (who wants to start a "debate club" at her school). So I guess these factors explain my "hang-up."

 

2. "Mokusatsu" is a verb, not a noun. It expresses a method of communication which I will, hereinafter, always exercise with you.

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i am not an officer of the court or a father, and in my ideal world we'd use less offensive language. however, this is an open forum that eschews censorship or limits on language. i'd like less swearing, but i'd also like to be taller...

 

you do understand this is a high school debate board right? a place for HS kids to get together and talk about things that are of interest to them. the student writing the initial post was LEGITIMATELY CURIOUS regarding a performance affirmative and what the best way to answer topicality. all they need to know from you (if you think it's stupid and people doing it should LEAVE THE ACTIVITY) is what your name is so they can strike you (that means remove you from their specific judging pool).

 

if you don't want your daughter reading this flith flarn flith (note my bill cosby reference) then block this from her computer. if you don't like what the scu thinks, that's fine. it IS america. but to suggest, even in jest, that people that think differently than you should leave the activity is just plain wrong. and to sit around and berate kids who don't get your references beacuse they WEREN'T ALIVE to have a reference point to the people you're referring to.

 

have a nice day

 

doug dennis

speech and debate director

saint francis high school

mountain view, ca

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Thanks, Doug. (And I mean that sincerely.)

 

But please go back and read my "incendiary" earlier posts. All I suggested (and in jest) was that performancce debaters "create their own event." By that, I was implicitly referring to creating an alternative debate forum, and that has been done on numerous occasions: public forum debate (HS), Parlimentary Debate (college), and CEDA (college). I have never suggested or implied that anyone leave the activity - even me.

 

BTW: I hope to see you this Fall. I have heard great things about Mountain View. Do you have any old-time NDHS-affiliated folks up there?

 

With every good wish... :)

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