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College Judging

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yes. if you didn't get the point, he is trying to keep the varsity division the way it was meant to be...policy debate, which would exclude kritiks. the freestyle division is for people willing to debate not just policy but the kritikal and philosophical aspects of plans.

 

I heard it loud and clear, Holzman, jus' cause I debated for the other South doesn't make me a total bumpkin. :)

 

My underlying point (which I suppose wasn't articulated well given the fact I put it in the form of an open-ended question) is that to explicitly ban a certain version of argumentation is kinda antithetical to everything that a forum such as debate ought to stand for--a marketplace of ideas, for lack of a better term. I also agree with Jackson in that such a distinction risks the non-kritikal division being placed in a second-class light.

 

I am glad that, at the very least, a division is being offered for kritikal debaters to compete in, and I sincerely applaud the efforts to end the elitism associated with the term "champ debate." I simply think that if debaters want to have an educational debate about the philosophical implications of an advocacy, then instead of segregating them off, just let them debate. If a coach or a judge doesn't like it, tough. They can deal with it. Any time a tournament or a judge explicitly tells a debater they aren't allowed to run a certain kind of argument, an angel loses its wings.

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Well, like I said you are all welcome to critique my approach and results.

 

Eric I understood your point. However, I have many constituents that can't/won't see it that way. This includes people who are less and less willing to judge because some teams really don't care to adapt.

 

In case you aren't sure, the idea that non-critical debate is lower class exists in some circles already. But these discussions have been had many places in these threads.

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does the combining of the "college judging" and "olathe north" threads mean ON will have only college judges, or did some mod just screw up? i wanted to read more about freestyling but got a bunch of tiny facebook profiles instead.

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Well, like I said you are all welcome to critique my approach and results.

 

Eric I understood your point. However, I have many constituents that can't/won't see it that way. This includes people who are less and less willing to judge because some teams really don't care to adapt.

 

In case you aren't sure, the idea that non-critical debate is lower class exists in some circles already. But these discussions have been had many places in these threads.

 

Fair enough. I do think judge adaptation is a critical skill to learn (and even more so now, having converted to the dark side of parli debate), but the naive idealist in me is hoping that can be balanced with argumentative freedom. I still appreciate a lot of the goals you're trying to accomplish with this tournament, and I hope you succeed in them.

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does the combining of the "college judging" and "olathe north" threads mean ON will have only college judges, or did some mod just screw up? i wanted to read more about freestyling but got a bunch of tiny facebook profiles instead.

 

For the record ON will not have only college judges nor will all the college judges here want to judge critiques. I am not sure what you mean about the thread. My understanding was that this thread was where the college community announced intent/desire to judge. I posted our event because of the freestyle portion. I did the exact same thing last year. Have fun Pete. Perhaps one of you would be willing to spend some time making a master list like was done last year by Mr. I Love Spark?

 

I do think judge adaptation is a critical skill to learn (and even more so now, having converted to the dark side of parli debate), but the naive idealist in me is hoping that can be balanced with argumentative freedom.

 

I still have some of that naive idealism in me too in spite of how hard the world tries to beat it out of me ;)

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I am not a "college judge" anymore ... but if anyone needs judges for thier tournament feel free to contact me.

 

bryan(dot)dreiling(at)gmail(dot)com

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Well I'm not sure how much you all want me around but I'm in Lawrence and I am always willing to Judge. I'd prefer not driving too much though. My contact information is as follows:

Torrance Parkins

Freshman @ KU (Not debating)

Extensive high school experience (McPherson), I keep a good flow (not neat, but accurate nonetheless :P) and I already have 7 rounds on this topic so I'm sort of familiar.

email: db8stud14@hotmail.com

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I'm working for STA, but any free weekend that you might need a judge, look me up.

 

Debated for McPherson (4 years)

Freshman at KU (probably debating soon, but not this semester)

Preferably Champ/Varsity

 

juliag(at)ku(dot)edu

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Karson Thompson

Junior at KU

"Qualified." Formerly of the "we travel more on Friday than you do all season" Garden City High School debate squad.

Lawrence/Topeka/KC area.

karson at ku dot edu

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at Olathe North

 

Austin Hayden

junior at KU

4 years at Olathe East (co 2004)

I'd really prefer to judge freestyle, sounds like fun

ahayden3(AT)ku.edu

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Justin Alldritt

Taking year off before college

Debated Open last two years of HS (The Independent School)

Could only judge on Saturday morning/early afternoon rounds

Wichita area only

justin001atgmail.com

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There was confusion among the coaches about what divisions did what last year so I wish to make a clear difference for entering purposes. Freestyle will be whatever the judges and the teams make it. Last year it was pretty much pure champ. This year I want to try to serve everyone but I think my point might be a bit missed. And that is fine.

 

Here is my point. I am tired of the great divide. I wish to support as many ideas/styles as possible. I don't think one style has to be superior to the other but I am specific only to try to ensure to the coaches what division is what. I will not be able to make everone happy but many of you are getting used to the fact that I do have a bit of a strange point of view. I don't want some teams avoiding our tournament because of style issues. All are welcome.

 

Humor me...I am trying.

 

I am specifically trying to eliminate the word "champ". If you don't like it feel free to run a K on me :D

 

I think you just ran a k on the use of the word champ in hs debate. I like your alt.

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I think you just ran a k on the use of the word champ in hs debate. I like your alt.

 

Yeah, and if you guys would explain them that way you could run them with lay judges and win! :P

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I'm so glad these kids get judges who will judge in such a great way. You great non-debating college kids with nothing better to do are giving Kansas high school kids the experience in debate that you were deprived by "traditional" judges who only listened to arguements that weren't too extreme. God bless all of you. I wish we had judges who didn't care if an arguement was logical, reasonable, and from a valid source back when I debated in high school. I really missed out. I mean, it's great to have a judge in the back of the room who thinks the round is about them, and who gets mad if they don't see enough "offense". I really wish I had judges who would listen to me when i said the negative doesn't have enough offense. I'd have won so many more rounds. I love you cool judges who want to debate in high school but can't, you make debate what it should be.

 

Where's your bridge...?

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I'm so glad these kids get judges who will judge in such a great way. You great non-debating college kids with nothing better to do are giving Kansas high school kids the experience in debate that you were deprived by "traditional" judges who only listened to arguements that weren't too extreme. God bless all of you. I wish we had judges who didn't care if an arguement was logical, reasonable, and from a valid source back when I debated in high school. I really missed out. I mean, it's great to have a judge in the back of the room who thinks the round is about them, and who gets mad if they don't see enough "offense". I really wish I had judges who would listen to me when i said the negative doesn't have enough offense. I'd have won so many more rounds. I love you cool judges who want to debate in high school but can't, you make debate what it should be.

 

I'll have you know that I CAN debate in highschool! I have one year of elgibility left, and, one day, I'm going to use it and beat every Blue Valley team on Zizek!

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I'm so glad these kids get judges who will judge in such a great way. You great non-debating college kids with nothing better to do are giving Kansas high school kids the experience in debate that you were deprived by "traditional" judges who only listened to arguements that weren't too extreme. God bless all of you. I wish we had judges who didn't care if an arguement was logical, reasonable, and from a valid source back when I debated in high school. I really missed out. I mean, it's great to have a judge in the back of the room who thinks the round is about them, and who gets mad if they don't see enough "offense". I really wish I had judges who would listen to me when i said the negative doesn't have enough offense. I'd have won so many more rounds. I love you cool judges who want to debate in high school but can't, you make debate what it should be.

 

You forgot about the part where we think that anyone who can't spread is automatically a tool.

 

Seriously, you can at least be thankful that so many judges, be they lay, college, or any other demographic, are willing to sacrifice their weekends for the sake of this activity. And if you can't...go call the waaaaahmbulance and take your pissing and moaning to them.

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Yeah, and if you guys would explain them that way you could run them with lay judges and win! :P

 

i think that this would be possible, it just requires a tinkering of the prejudging teaching session before tournaments and A TON of work by the individual debaters. To properly articulate political theory that has been developed over 5000 yrs is very hard to do.

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I think you're a couple weeks behind the rest of Kansas CX.

 

yeah... i only check up every other month or so and post when i'm really interested.

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I'll have you know that I CAN debate in highschool! I have one year of elgibility left, and, one day, I'm going to use it and beat every Blue Valley team on Zizek!

 

Esnob isn't actually Riffer, Steve. That was a joke.

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