Jump to content
ihsdebate

550pg PMF file!!

Recommended Posts

Damn, you must be incredible to be able to make a few 1NC arguments that will win you the roung regardless of the skill of the other team and the arguments they make in response to you.

 

no no no, you misunderstand. his PARTNER is that good. :-P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ankur's Review of the PMF File Put Out By WFI

 

I give the file a massive ten digits down. The case, as previously mentioned, is at heart nothing but a draft case. It masquerades as something different but with little reward. The gross negligence in putting the file together is obvious upon even a mere cursory examination - flaws which cannot be forgiven. The camp attempts to make up for its glaring errors by producing a massive file - classic debatism - "we dont have good evidence, but we have MORE evidence than you do! ha ha ha!" This is a great example of how a debater can do nothing but case pimps, 16 minutes of case pimps and face crush the aff. If you want tips on how to learn to do this, well, you know how to get a hold of me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fair enough.

 

You are right that it is simply a draft aff. I think at first it started out as planning to be a "ban pmc" aff, but then when we realized that was not topical (at best fx) it turned into a draft aff that focused on getting PMCs to stop being hired by the US military.

 

However, it being a draft aff is not a bad thing. For Every reason you have that expanding military is bad, having PMCs large is worse. It's a totally different approach to the draft aff (which is needed) that using it's large size and array of advantages is able to turn virtually every neg position. The advantages are stellar.

 

One thing I don't find fair is what you say about the evidence not being high quality. Sure, some of the cards in there might be off target (what file is perfect), but I'm going to contend you could take all of those out and still have at least a 400 page file that wins you plenty of rounds.

 

What flaws are you talking about that cannot be forgiven? I'm curious what you have to say, Ankur. We really didn't find much with the aff that would be considered "glaring errors." I guess you could either post here what you think or just pm me personally.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ankur's Review of the PMF File Put Out By WFI

 

I give the file a massive ten digits down. The case, as previously mentioned, is at heart nothing but a draft case. It masquerades as something different but with little reward. The gross negligence in putting the file together is obvious upon even a mere cursory examination - flaws which cannot be forgiven. The camp attempts to make up for its glaring errors by producing a massive file - classic debatism - "we dont have good evidence, but we have MORE evidence than you do! ha ha ha!" This is a great example of how a debater can do nothing but case pimps, 16 minutes of case pimps and face crush the aff. If you want tips on how to learn to do this, well, you know how to get a hold of me.

 

I don't think the purpose of camp files is to be either perfect or complete, but rather to assemble a large collection of evidence that is to be refined, culled, and expanded upon later on before the season begins. Camps operate under a different set of pressures than does an individual team in preparing files.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I don't think the purpose of camp files is to be either perfect or complete, but rather to assemble a large collection of evidence that is to be refined, culled, and expanded upon later on before the season begins. Camps operate under a different set of pressures than does an individual team in preparing files.

 

Ankur and I are kind of talking about the file and the way it works. I'm not exactly sure what the final decision will be, but I'm assuming we'll let you guys know. (not to say oneof us is right or wrong, rather coming to an informed decision on the truth).

 

T-Cram, you judged the PMF aff (when we ran lower volunteer standards). what did you think of the aff (even tho it wasn't talked about much after the 1ac).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

travis,

kids go to camp to learn how to cut evidence the right way, to learn how to put together a good aff etc. by lack of good oversight by lab leaders, the kids are not walking away with the skills necessary to build good cases. and it shows in the non-camp cases being run as well. i guarantee that if lab leaders rigorously scrutinize the evidence and really work on building a GOOD case... then the landscape of debate will change drastically for the better.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
travis,

kids go to camp to learn how to cut evidence the right way, to learn how to put together a good aff etc. by lack of good oversight by lab leaders, the kids are not walking away with the skills necessary to build good cases. and it shows in the non-camp cases being run as well. i guarantee that if lab leaders rigorously scrutinize the evidence and really work on building a GOOD case... then the landscape of debate will change drastically for the better.

 

There was definitely no lack of good oversight by the lab leaders at WFI, don't get it twisted.

 

But indefinitely, camp evidence will be low quality in comparison to stuff you cut for yourself in the year. Camp is also more than evidence.

 

I also still say that the evidence in this file is high quality, and (even with minor holes) is a great compendium of evidence. Naturally I'm biased because I spent a week working on it, but I think so far I've answered the questions you have raised adequately.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i'm still wondering why there's a thread stickied about an affirmative file that a camp produced and that can't be downloaded in that thread

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
i'm still wondering why there's a thread stickied about an affirmative file that a camp produced and that can't be downloaded in that thread
Because the forum mod wants to flatter his pal for some reason...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have the aff, but I haven't gotten the time to read over ALL of the advs. I was wondering if all of the advs stemmed off the PMCs or if sum are general draft advs? If they all stemmed off PMC decreasing, then all the regular Draft advs put with that would give you a crap load of advs, and you could turn virtually everything.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I have the aff, but I haven't gotten the time to read over ALL of the advs. I was wondering if all of the advs stemmed off the PMCs or if sum are general draft advs? If they all stemmed off PMC decreasing, then all the regular Draft advs put with that would give you a crap load of advs, and you could turn virtually everything.

 

Yes, every advantage in the file is specific to PMCs, and sure you could use regular ol' draft advantages also.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ankur's Review of the PMF File Put Out By WFI

 

I give the file a massive ten digits down. The case, as previously mentioned, is at heart nothing but a draft case. It masquerades as something different but with little reward. The gross negligence in putting the file together is obvious upon even a mere cursory examination - flaws which cannot be forgiven. The camp attempts to make up for its glaring errors by producing a massive file - classic debatism - "we dont have good evidence, but we have MORE evidence than you do! ha ha ha!" This is a great example of how a debater can do nothing but case pimps, 16 minutes of case pimps and face crush the aff. If you want tips on how to learn to do this, well, you know how to get a hold of me.

 

Ankur, I don't mean to attack you or anything, but what Aff do you feel is the best/better than this one? Just curious.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ankur, I don't mean to attack you or anything, but what Aff do you feel is the best/better than this one? Just curious.

duh, give renewable energy to china.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ankur, I don't mean to attack you or anything, but what Aff do you feel is the best/better than this one? Just curious.

 

spratly islands [sp?].

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ankur,

 

I truly wonder if you've been a staff-member of a camp within the past ten years because it seems that you have no idea how one runs. It is not our job to cut the positions that kids will run through the entire season and produce files that are polished and ready to go. Rather, it is to expose them to a very broad and diverse range of literature and ideas from which to establish a position from which to go further. And it is quite possible to do that along-side personal guidance of students and teaching them to cut quality evidence. I doubt coaches or parents would be very happy to find out that their kids dropped several thousand dollars on camp to come back with one or two small files that the lab leaders aggressively edited and controlled because they subjectively felt that there was only a select view cards and arguments that met their standards.

 

And movingonup, I think the aff has promise but needs work. It's a sweet impact area in terms of scope and development of the argumentation, but the internal link solvency leaves much to be desired as to why a draft is the necessary component to solve for the use of PMFs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
spratly islands [sp?].
No, that's his cure for cancer... ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

×
×
  • Create New...