44 replies to this topic

[codyarmstrong]

Chaos, on 26 February 2012 - 07:31 PM, said:

I HATE THAT SO MUCH. Like, as a judge, I don't know how to treat those arguments. I usually err on the side of not evaluating them as turns, but it makes me uncomfortable.

Why would that make you uncomfortable? If I say, "First off is the topicality..." then read a DisAd shell and say that you have to treat it as a priori because I call it a topicality, do you evaluate it as what it actually is or what I say it is?

[Rawrcat]

Calling an argument a "turn" connotes it as being offense. Just because someone calls a defensive argument a "turn" doesn't mean it's an offensive turn

[Chaos]

SpiderCat, on 26 February 2012 - 09:27 PM, said:

Calling an argument a "turn" connotes it as being offense. Just because someone calls a defensive argument a "turn" doesn't mean it's an offensive turn

What does the word "turn" mean if it applies equally well to offense or defense? That "the opposite of their claims is true"?

I suppose that's one interpretation, but I think some debaters say "turn" in defensive situations where they think it is actually offense.

codyarmstrong, on 26 February 2012 - 08:06 PM, said:

Why would that make you uncomfortable? If I say, "First off is the topicality..." then read a DisAd shell and say that you have to treat it as a priori because I call it a topicality, do you evaluate it as what it actually is or what I say it is?

It makes me uncomfortable precisely because it's difficult to definitively determine what to do in these situations. I think the proper response is going to be based on your opponent's arguments and how they treat the "topicality" in the round, but it makes me feel icky when I have to resolve this type of stupidity. I would probably not evaluate your argument as an a priori if your only warrant for treating it as a priori was "it is a topicality argument, and all topicality arguments are a prioris". The categorization of the argument is going to be largely irrelevant to how I prioritize it in my decision calculus; I need actual warrants to justify prioritization.

[Rawrcat]

Chaos, on 27 February 2012 - 06:36 AM, said:

What does the word "turn" mean if it applies equally well to offense or defense? That "the opposite of their claims is true"?

I suppose that's one interpretation, but I think some debaters say "turn" in defensive situations where they think it is actually offense.

I said "offensive turn" to push that a turn is offensive, not to try and define a particular kind of turn which implied that a "defensive turn" is a thing.

[Ganondorf901]

Semantics aside, I feel like punching someone every time I hear "The didn't answer our 'Global Warming is over-exaggerated' turn!"

Edit: Especially when I answered it.